Scripture reference: 1 Kings 17; 1 Timothy 6:10 (NKJV); 1 Timothy 6:6-7 (TPT); 1 Timothy 6:8-10 (TPT); 1 Tim. 6:6-10 (MSG); 1 Corinthians 2:1-12 (NKJV)


Pastor John: 

How are you all doing today? [Congregation: Good thank you, Pastor John.] [Pastor Christi: …and you Pastor John?] I’m doing good, thank you, Pastor Christi.


Praise the Lord. It’s a good day to be in the House of the Lord. It’s a good day to receive from the Lord the things that He has for us and I know it’s school holidays at the moment and there are people that are away. I have encouraged them that in this vacation season, they would at least watch this when they can and catch up with it because of an important moment that the Lord has prepared for us. Amen. Hallelujah.


I’d like you to just agree with me right now in prayer and we just trust the Lord that any interference that would prevent the revelation of God from entering into your hearts and all those that will watch by way of camera or some other platform that those forces will not stop the Light of the Gospel from entering in their hearts, all of your hearts, for it to do the work that it needs to do and it will bring us to the maximum that we can achieve – the highest level attainable – that we have all the things that God has for us in Christ Jesus. Amen. Hallelujah.


It is a wonderful thing that we are living in this season. It is an ordained time of God. Well, of course, there’s a God timetable for all of humanity and for the earth and we are certainly on a timetable of great significance. I know that almost every person that’s lived on the earth, for them the age of their time on the earth, has always been the most significant. I suppose that’s the nature of our humanity, that we consider our time on the earth, as the most significant time. But, at the same time, there is a God-ordained calendar, there is a God-ordained time and we just happen to be the blessed ones to be on this time, on His time and on this calendar. Amen.


So, before I get going with the message this morning, we have a couple of visitors from the United States, from all the way of Crowley Texas, and we want to welcome Eric and Nikki. Welcome, please stand up guys, because you know Drew [their son sitting in the middle of them], he doesn’t have to stand up and make them look small, but welcome Eric and Nikki. It’s good to have them with us and we look forward to what God is going to say to us through them also. Amen. Praise the Lord.


All right, there are a few different things that we’re going to do on this weekend. I’ve done a couple of interviews. When I went through the interviews, I didn’t know that… Matthew can maybe bear me out on this, but I don’t know that we’ve had as many technical challenges to produce a simple interview video as we’ve had with these two videos. It’s just an amazing thing to me. We had challenges with the sound, we had challenges with just many different things that we had to do it over and over again and eventually yesterday, I came in and actually sat with the editors, and we worked through the process. 


And well, the interviewees, I interviewed them for just under 30 minutes each and it was clear that everything they said was very important, but it was just not possible for us to show all of the interviews this weekend. So we are going to, as we show you an edited version of the interview, what parts I thought would be most relevant to today, we are also going to send you, by the end of the day, we are going to send you a link that you can go and watch the full interview and access the video, the portion of the interview that you will see. Because I do think that their interview is that important that you should watch the whole thing. But if I had to show both of the interviews to you today, it would come to an hour. And in our modern-day world, watching someone else talk on a digital screen for an hour, in a public space, is probably not going to fly. Amen. Praise the Lord.


So, we’re going to start off this session, before I get to minister, we’re going to start off with the first interview and the first interview that you’re going to watch, is me talking to Hanna. So thank you, Hanna, for doing that. You’ll see what is going to be shown is very different to what you experienced because it’s an edited version, but I do want to encourage you that when the whole conference is said and done, you will get a link so that you can watch the whole interview, because it’s really, really good – very important. Are we ready for that clip?


[Pastor John asks if he needs to take the pulpit down (for a better view of the screen behind him). Empie helps him to take it down.]


Pastor John: 

Hallo everybody. Thank you for joining us for this very special interview. I’m doing something that has really been on my heart. The Holy Spirit has directed me to do some interviews with people that have been with the ministry for some time and I believe that you’re going to be blessed by what they have today and have to say.


So, in this interview, I’m with Hanna Prinsloo. Hanna has been with us for 15 years in Heritage of Faith and we have known the family for longer than that, but actively in the church for at least 15 years. So, welcome Hanna.



Thank you, Pastor John.


Pastor John

Thank you for joining us today and I believe the Holy Spirit will be present in everything that we say…





Pastor John

…and even though we’re talking to cameras and there’s a digital world out there that’s listening, I believe the Holy Spirit will make what we say come alive to them and they will receive it and they will be blessed by it. So, let’s jump straight in.


So Hanna, one of the things we are going to talk about, is you have been running a successful recruitment agency company for some time and God has blessed you financially. And I just would like for you to talk for a little bit about the way that you view the money that comes into your company, the way that you see your mission and your purpose with regards to money and just talk around that a little bit.



Yeah. So, Pastor John, I mean, over the years, there’s so much that the Lord has taught me about the purpose for finances. You know, when we started getting into the whole faith message and that initially… I don’t know exactly where we picked up on, you know, the financial blessing or that, it would probably have been quite from the beginning. I got born again when I was 13 years old.


Pastor John: 

Right, right.



But, the purpose really in the first however many years was all about, you know, I can make more money because I can get more stuff, I can travel more, I can have nicer houses, nicer cars, you know. And I was very into that. It was very attractive you know. And it was all about me. And then…


Pastor John: 

And actually, to some extent, the faith message really feeds into that, right?



It does.


Pastor John: 

It’s like, I can use my faith to get more for me. Yeah.



Exactly. And the Lord is that gracious because He does want us to live a very good life.


Pastor John: 

He wants us to live in abundance.



But, when it’s all about us, then that money purpose is very, very skewed, you know, because, as we spoke a little bit earlier now, you know, I mean, God doesn’t need my money. He really doesn’t. He can make much more of it any time, anyway.


Pastor John: 

If He wants to.



He really doesn’t need it. So for Him to actually test me on money or to give me stewardship over money, means there’s something the Lord has started teaching me about finances and finances in the Kingdom. And it’s so amazingly rewarding to be working with God in finances and having the opportunity from God to use finances in a way that glorifies and honours Him.


You know, in the world, money is so much about power and the two go so close together all the time. And it is really that love of money, not just money itself, but the love of it, that is the root of all evil. But if you don’t love it, and you love God first, and you honour Him first, then money becomes such a powerful tool for God’s purposes on the earth and what it really should be, you know.


Pastor John: 

Right. Isn’t that just something that’s amazing Hanna, that if you’re focused on money in the world, it’s about what money can do for you, and how you can gain more stuff, more power, more image, more status, more stuff. But at the same time, money in God, and you with money and God can do so much more for you in your walk with God and in the way that you live life with God. 





Pastor John: 

Same, same money, just two completely different things, outcomes. One is all self-orientated, power-orientated, and self-love-orientated. The other one is about purpose and meaning and value in life and eternity. Yeah. 



And you know, Pastor John, when you look at it, from an outside perspective, it’s a very attractive life, these movie stars, these very rich billionaires. They have everything that they have need of. And I mean, all of us, you’re looking at it and you think, “My goodness, it would be nice just to be that comfortable.” 


Pastor John: 

I can do with that.



I can do with that; exactly. And but what it doesn’t show you and sometimes you get glimpses of the price that they are paying and how demanding it is. Because the devil sits behind that, he keeps on demanding more and wanting more. So the cost of that money, if it’s not submitted to God, those billions and those millions and even those 10 rands and five rands, because the little and the much can become a very, very harsh master, and it will always want more because the devil is behind it. It’s that horrible greed thing behind that, you know. Whereas if it is in God and submitted to God, the fulfilment that comes with it and the joy that comes with it because in the end, it’s just money. 


Pastor John: 




You know, that when it’s with Him, and in Him, it’s so powerful. You know, there’s a guy that we knew, and it’s actually a bit of a sad story, but it’s something that is marked me. He did quite well and he was in the church. Really also one foot in the church, one foot in the world, but he had such an… I don’t know what to call it, really but he understood that you needed to pay your tithes. And he was very scared that if he didn’t pay his tithe then you know…


Pastor John: 

His life was over.



Exactly. So it became a very mechanical thing. I mean, he would do whatever it takes to get the tithe into the church at the end of the month, you know. There was no honour for God, there was no desire to live a life for God. And what does it mean, then? So you can even get…


Pastor John: 

Almost just like a debt you pay? 





Pastor John: 

Yeah, it’s like an insurance policy, I just got to make sure my insurance policy is paid for every month, then I’m okay. Whereas actually, the Lord has really taken the principles of the Word and elevated it into your life as honour. You want to talk about that a little bit, how you see the word of God and how your money in the way that you sow your seed is about honour, it’s not just about a debt that you pay, or an insurance policy. So tithes and terumah talk a little bit about that, Hanna.



And that really is for, for me, Pastor John, honour has an, it’s been a progressive growing into that, but honour is for me at the root, and top and the bottom and the middle, and everything of what I do financially…


Pastor John: 




…in the house of the Lord, and really in my life itself, you know, because it goes into every area. But whether I bring a tithe or a terumah and the first fruits are part of that, that the principles in the way God is put in the order of what you do with your money, the first fruit going to the priest, to the person of God, that is put because it’s right to look after the ones in the House of the Lord. It’s such a small portion that He requires for that, and then there is the tithe, and then there are the offerings to give, which is over and above and outside of that. But all of that is worship, all of that is honour to God. Because the fact that I have two cents in my hand that I can give or that I can pay tithe on or that I had any kind of income, whether I think I’m gonna make it at the end of the month, and whether I know I’m short and cashed up, because sometimes with my business, you know.


Pastor John: 

It happens.





Pastor John

Any business is like that.



I mean, even if you earn a salary, stuff can come up and you just don’t know how you’re gonna make it. But for me, it’s an absolute non-negotiable, the tithe and terumah not because of the law principle and, yes, the obedience principles very much there, but it’s not obedience without honour. 


And you know, when I bring my tithes and when I bring my terumah, I mean, my first prayer before the Lord is, “Lord, thank You for what You have increased me with because the fact that I have anything that I can give means that You have added something to my life. The fact that I could have earned an income, even if it seems short. It’s because You actually put giftings in me, You put breath in me, You made me, You put me on the earth.” If I wasn’t here I wouldn’t even have had that opportunity to be able to do that. So, there’s such a small portion of what He’s entrusted me with that He actually requires me to pay back to Him, and all that that says is, “Lord, I honour You and I trust You. I trust You. You know how to take care of me so I don’t need to hold on to this. You’ve got me.”


Pastor John: 

Right, right. Well, I trust that this that we’ve been talking about so far already is blessing you.



We’ve been walking with you for time and some of those words that you’ve brought, it wasn’t year one or year two, you know. We’ve developed a relationship, you got to know us, we got to know you. We learned about submission to authority. You know, I’m sidelining here a little bit but the very first Sunday that we came after we joined Heritage, it was still there in Northriding, and Pastor Sharon spoke about submission to authority. Pastor John, it felt like someone took a knife and cut my insides out like this [gestures slicing with a knife]. I felt like I was in pieces but I never felt as free. So you know, when we got that right, and you started understanding, okay, submission to authority. It stretches you because remember, before that, even in the church, we did what we wanted.


Pastor John: 

Free agents. Do what I want to do, when I want to do it.



Of course, I’m also prophetic and I hear the voice of the Holy Spirit. So really, who should tell me what I need to do? So there’s been big growing and adjustment in that. But as that progressively happened, we obviously were also positioned in a place where the Lord could use you to speak those kinds of words, you know. If we think back to what happened with the widow at Zarephath in 1 Kings 17. I mean, the prophet came. The Lord didn’t choose the richest person, the city who had extra, they were at their very last meal for her and her son. He said, “Now you feed the Prophet.” She got that word from the prophet, not even from… She had to think, “Okay, this is a man that’s telling me to do this thing now. I need to obey here.” She did.


Pastor John: 

She had a choice. Yeah.



Exactly. It saved their life and then after when the devil came to actually take her son’s life, she got him back from death, actually, he was resurrected again. So that is the same thing. I mean, you had a word for me that about in a 30-day period that there is going to be such an income coming in, and it was the biggest I’ve ever done up to that stage. Then with that, when that money came in, there was so much extra available and I could put that into Kingdom projects.


Pastor John

Project that God put on your heart to do.



Exactly, which the Lord put on my heart, which was so strong, you know, and I’ve never gone without. There were times when it was more difficult but I’ve never gone without. Never. You know, I heard Keith Moore, some, I don’t know a year or two years, whatever back saying, he said, “Sometimes faith is spelt T I M E.”


Pastor John

Right. Right.



That hit it home, you know because the only reason why we will lose the outcome of our faith is if we give up. It does, it tests you sometimes because you thought. “Sjo, surely in a year, I should have now had my harvest on this, or in two years or in five years,” and then it takes ten years. If you give up, then you think it’s never going to happen. You’re already walking away from the harvest, there is no way it can happen. But if it takes ten years instead of five or twenty, instead of ten but you stay with it, you know. I mean, one of the things He taught me as well, is to keep that word before you.


Pastor John: 

Well, thank you, Hanna.



Thank you, Pastor John.


Pastor John: 

I pray that you are blessed and there are more interviews. But from Heritage of Faith Ministries, thank you.


(End of video interview)


Well, how good was that? Hallelujah. Like I said, there’s a whole lot more value in the interview, for you to go and explore for yourself. Because there’s a lot more that is said that I think will be of benefit to you. I feel this is the way the Lord is leading me for this weekend. But also there will be more other people and more opportunities for me to interview all of you here. Not all of you, but some of you, from all of you. 


Because I think it’s important that we hear from the people that have been in the ministry, what they’re going through, where they are right now, how God has helped them, and how they’ve walked and had their own journey with God. I think it’s important because we overcome by the blood of the Lamb, and the Word of our testimony. Amen. Praise the Lord. Are you ready? Good. The title of our weekend is Money with a Mission. So, I’m going to just touch on a few things and then I’ll start our journey that we’re going to take this weekend. I briefly referred to this in one of my Sunday messages. 


Now I’m going to talk about capacity and capability. I want to just give you a definition of capacity. Capacity is the maximum amount that something can contain. We are in the year of maximum. So, the maximum amount that something can contain. Fully occupying the available area or space. The amount that something can produce. The ability or power to do or understand something. So that is capacity. I really am quite engaged with this word capacity, because it is the maximum amount that something can produce. Of course, if we’re talking about the Word of God, then the Word of God that is in you, that you are speaking out there has a capacity. The capacity is not based on what you can do with the Word of God, but the capacity is in the Word of God and what It can produce. So if you think that it’s all of your confession that’s making it work, it’s not. Your confession is just making sure that you stay on course, with what God has already spoken, and that your mind and your words don’t counteract what God’s Word is already doing. Because the fruitfulness and the capacity are in the Word. Amen. 


If you learn nothing else except this the whole weekend, it’s enough. Really, because, you know, I’m going to talk a little bit about time, energy, performance and different things over this period of the weekend. So let me go on and talk about capability or being capable. So, if you’re capable of doing something, it means you have the ability, or quality necessary to achieve a specific thing. It can also mean, being open to or admitting something. So you’re capable of being admitted to something. Able to achieve efficiently whatever one has to do. In other words, your competence – ability or capacity or capability is you’re competent. You’re competent to achieve efficiently, whatever one has to do. If you look at the word capable in the Thesaurus, and they just have a few words that come in line with that, if you’re capable, then you’re competent, you’re able, you’re efficient, you’re effective, you’re accomplished, practised, experience skilful, gifted. These things make up the definition of the word capable.


Now, you heard Hanna minister or just share with us in her testimony here, how when she came to the church, Pastor Sharon was ministering on submission to authority and how it really impacted her and challenged her. It’s something that is extremely difficult to navigate as a subject in the Church. It shouldn’t be but it is. And the major reason for it is because, in our modern-day world, we live very much in – certainly in the Western world – we live very much in a democratic society where you can choose to vote how you want to vote, and therefore the whole concept of a Western democracy is people have the right to choose whatever they want to choose and live the way they want to live. Now, God’s Kingdom is not a democracy. 


Whilst He gives us the option to choose, He isn’t a democracy. His Kingdom is not a democracy. He didn’t take a vote with Jesus and the Holy Spirit to decide to make the earth. They didn’t vote on it. They all agreed on it. They were in agreement, they were synchronised because they all had the same spirit. They were of the same spirit, so there was no vote. There was no vote. You know, we think in the Western world that when you have a democratic country, it’s the highest level of governing authority or system is a democracy. It’s not actually but it is where we live. The Jewish people live in a system, as do the Muslims, generally speaking. A lot of Muslim countries, they live in a government that is a theocracy. In other words, the theology of what they believe drives the way they govern. As it is, actually, Israel has become less of a theocracy, and more of a democracy as time has gone by. Nevertheless, the foundation of everything they do is a theology, it’s how they see Jehovah, how they walk and work with God.


This only becomes really relevant because if you want to attach a way of governing to any system, you have to define it, and then you define it by the major way that a country governs. So if you define a country that is a socialist country, you’re defining an order of government that has a direct impact on the economy and the way that money is driven through the system. If you’re talking about a communist country, then again, you’re talking about a governing system that determines the way that money is driven through the economy. If you’re talking about democracy, generally, democracies used to be known for the fact that they are very capitalistic oriented. 


But it wasn’t always just like that, because if you look at France and Germany, Italy, England and Holland, they were all imperialist-based governments, which means they were first started off as a monarchy, and the monarchy is a kingdom. And you have a king who determines what happens in the kingdom, and so the king wanted to increase his wealth and his influence. So he would go and take his set of beliefs, and go to war with other countries so that he could govern those countries and then get the wealth out of those countries for his own wealth.


So, what we consider as capitalism today is not necessarily just about a single way of managing money. It’s just a reference point as to how money flows through the system. And it’s got more entrepreneurial-based influences than socialism, communism and other forms. So, I don’t mean this to be a history lesson or an economic lesson. I’m just giving you a broad framework of how we see money and how money flows because when we talk about the subject of authority, authority only really becomes an issue when it’s revealed in governance. If you ask a Christian, any Christian; do you believe in the authority, the supreme authority of God? Almost every Christian is likely to say, yes. I believe it’s actually completely skewed because everybody says, a lot of Christians say, “God is in control.” So they believe that God has got so much authority on the earth, that He’s in control of everything. I don’t believe that. I believe God is not controlling your choices. He gave the ability to choose to you. So for me to say, “God is in control,” when I don’t feel in control, that doesn’t mean to say He’s in control.


My choices have brought me to the level of control that He has in my life or not. So for me to say, “I’m not doing so well, but God is in control.” That’s just not true. So God is not in control. He is in control of His agenda that will be implemented in the earth. But outside of that, He’s not in control. So when you talk about authority, you have to consider this question of governance and control. 


So it only becomes really important, authority only really becomes a subject when governance happens. So if you go out here, and you go on the highway and the signs say you must do 120 kilometres an hour. The authority has said, that’s the speed you must ride. The issue is never with the authority, the issue is in the governance. So if you self-govern, you will never have an encounter with the authority. If you self-govern. If you don’t self-govern, and you go above what the authority has declared to be the speed limit, then somewhere along the line, you’re going to encounter the authority who’s going to govern you. And they’re going to come and stop you on the road and say, “Come over here. Let’s talk a little bit. We are governing on behalf of the authority, you’ve broken the rules of authority, now we govern you to have broken the rule.” Now you pay a penalty for breaking the rule. 


Then the question… then you see people squirm. Sometimes they shout at the authority. Sometimes they argue with the authority. Sometimes they get mad when they get into the car, and they want to scream at the authority because they’ve been caught out of not self-governing. Right? So the authority of God is almost never an issue until there is a self-governance issue. And there is a governance consideration that happens in the church. So when we talk about submission to authority in the church, you can’t have a church that is an Ecclesia church where God has delegated authority to be working through the local church. You can’t have God’s saying here’s an Ecclesia with authority and then the authority has no rules. It has no mission. It has no opportunity to govern, because what are you going to govern if you are the Ecclesia if you are not under a government? 


So, if you’re the Ecclesia and God has ordained and called churches to be the Ecclesia, the ruling component of God’s authority on the earth. That’s what an Ecclesia is. So we must speak into the earth the things that God wants on the earth. Right? So how do we speak things into the earth that God wants onto the earth, if we ourselves are not under the authority of God, we have to be under His authority to be able to declare what He wants. And so you can’t have a church that you’ve got hundreds of people 1000s of people that are wanting to declare whatever they want to declare. Because that’s not how Ecclesia works. That’s not how God’s government works. So you have to have unity, you have to have a, you have to have a coming together with one mind with one heart. And then when you speak with one mind and one heart on behalf of God, you can rule and govern on His behalf on the earth. 


So when you talk about submission to authority, it’s not because we, as the leaders of the church want to say whatever we feel should be best for you in your life. It’s so that whatever we are doing together in life, we are doing it together in one accord with one heart with one mind, and we are flowing together. So if we’re talking about money, then we have to talk about money in the context of if you’re someone and Hanna refers to it in her message, and you’ll hear from someone else later on. But, if you’re in a position where you say, “Here’s my gift, God’s given me a gift, I’m using my faith, and my gift is to make money, and I choose how to spend my money. God’s got no way of telling me how to spend my money.” Then what is happening is that you are not in the ecclesia with your gift. What you’ve said is, “My gift is in this Ecclesia, the message of the Ecclesia is helping me in my gift, but I choose to spend my money the way I want to spend my money.” Really? Hmmm.


So there are many other gifts if we just want to talk about the gift of teaching, as opposed to the gift of missions or money, sorry, if we talk about the gift of teaching. If we don’t have a framework of what this ministry is, declaring as our foundation of teaching, and what we believe together, then anybody that’s in the church that’s got a teaching gift can say, “Well, I’m going to teach whatever I want to teach.” And so they if they teaching stuff, that as a ministry, we are not all in unity and in agreement to what we are ministering and what we stand in for, then you bring confusion. 


And so if one gift is in the Ecclesia, but another gift is not. Then it confuses the rest of the body to say, but this gift is not submitted and it’s not being used by God because they choose not to. So, when I’m talking about money with a mission, you must remember what I preached last Sunday – that I’m ministering as a shepherd. I’m not here to get your money. We are ministering this weekend because we need to have an understanding and a directive of where our gifts, our callings, and this Ecclesia is going. So authority is the power or right to give orders, make decisions and enforce obedience. Now God is never going to enforce obedience on us. So neither should we as Shepherds. Never enforce obedience. But the revelation that God gives you will. 


It requires you to be obedient to the revelation that He’s given you. To that extent, your revelation that you receive from God will always bring you to a crossroad and the crossroad will be, in a moment in time the revelation is going to speak to your heart. Then it’s going to cause you to have to act out what God’s spoken to your heart. If you say “No, I don’t want to do that.” Then what will happen is that at some point in time, you’re either going to deviate from that Ecclesia or you’re going to have to learn a new level of living with God with that revelation in a different way.


Just recently, I was speaking to Brother Joe on the phone and he was just saying to me, “We all have to learn, John, we all have to learn, we’re either going to learn through being taught, or we’re going to learn through experience; and sometimes it’s both.” He says, “It’s much better to learn by being taught than to learn through experience.” Because experience always has a cost. If you just learn by being taught, you say, “Well, I can receive the teaching, and I’m going to live the teaching,” then you or your experience is always going to be in line with God’s Word and the blessing and all the stuff He’s got.


Okay, authority is the right to act in a specified way, delegated from one person to another, or from one organization to another. So this is really amazing because God has delegated authority to us on the earth. We have the right to act in a certain way. Now, God can’t work with a church that is just filled with people who feel like they can act in whatever way they want. This is the biggest challenge with the church is that every Christian says, “I have my own walk with God, I’m going to live my own walk with God the way that I want to live with God. And I’m going to not even think about what the local church says.” So you’ve got everybody that’s got their own concept in their own way of how they should live with a gift, how they should live with their callings, how they should live with things. Actually, they are not connected to any Ecclesia because they won’t listen to what the Pastor’s got.


So we, as shepherds, have a responsibility to hear what God wants for this Ecclesia, keep us moving in the line of what He wants us to do with this Ecclesia then all the gifts and the callings can flourish and function in this Ecclesia. When we’re all functioning together in Ecclesia, then we all walk in a level of authority that is way above the level of authority that we as individual Christians can flow in. Because now we’re in the Body, we’re having authority as the Body and we can declare things, together, as the Body because we bring all of our gifts to the Body.


Now we functioning on a mission. Now we functioning on a mission. Now when we bring our money to work with a mission, we have a fulfilled purpose. We have a unity of assignment, we have everything working together. So when I felt we had to call this weekend, Money With A Mission; first, we have to understand what our mission is. Yes? Otherwise, you can’t send money to whatever you think is the mission. Yeah.


I’m going to read you first Timothy chapter six and I’m going to read verse six. I’m going to just start in the New King James with verse 10. Then I’ll read the verses to you from the Passion Translation and the Message Translation, I’ll read the rest of it to you. 10 For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil, for which some have strayed from the faith in their greediness, for the love of money is the root of all evil, all kinds of evil, for which some have strayed from the faith in their greediness and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. (1 Timothy 6:10 NKJV)


Why do people have sorrow when they have money? Well, they’ve got sorrow, because they love money. They love what money does for them. They love what money provides for them. So then they have sorrow with the money because they have no purpose or mission for their money. Then all manner of evil is, comes into their life because of the greediness of it. Let me read it, the whole passage of scripture from verse six to ten, from the Passion Translation, because it just puts it nicely.


6 We have a “profit” that is greater than theirs—our holy awe of God! We have a profit that is greater than the world because we have a holy awe of God. To have merely our necessities is to have enough. Why is having your necessities met enough? Because we have a holy awe of God because the fear of God is our standard of life, our love of God. So, even if your necessities are just met, that’s okay; that’s enough – if you have a relationship with God.


7 Isn’t it true that our hands were empty when we came into the world, and when we leave this world our hands will be empty again? (1 Timothy 6:6-7 TPT) I’ve got news for you – for however hard you work for money while you are on the earth when you breathe your last breath, you yourself will not walk into heaven and say, “God look at my bank account. My significance is in my bank account.” or how many shares I had in how many companies on the earth, or how much gold is stashed in my private safe, in my kitchen. Why kitchen? Well, if it’s under the fridge in the kitchen, no one is looking there for a safe. So, I stash my gold and my diamonds there. Hey, don’t come look in my kitchen – it’s not there. So I’ve got news for you, when you leave this earth, God is not a single bit interested in how much money you made. Nothing, it has no value, tradable or otherwise, in heaven.


I’ll tell you what you can do when you get to heaven is, “Lord, You gave me a gift to make money and I dispersed it. I had a mission. I was with the ecclesia, I was in the body. Look what I did with all of my…” And He says, “Yes, son. You gave to the poor, you were with the ecclesia, you used your gifts and your callings, you functioned and you flowed with obedience to Me, enter into the rest. Well done, good and faithful servant.” 


Now your money is a facilitator of your eternal future. So, some people might say, “Oh, but then what about the Bible that you can count on when you get to heaven? And you say, “I left an inheritance for my children and my children’s children?” Well, is money an inheritance? Or is your walk with God the inheritance? Because God said to Abraham, “I will make you the father of many nations because you will command them after Me. It’s not because I’m giving you so much wealth that you’re going to leave to Isaac, and to Jacob.” It wasn’t about the money, the money was just there to facilitate the way that he lived on the earth. I’m really preaching good today. 


So, 7 Isn’t it true that our hands were empty… Verse eight, 8 Because of this, food and clothing is enough to make us content. Oh, no Pastor John, I’m not satisfied with just food or clothing. Really? Well, maybe if you’re not satisfied with it, maybe there’s something in your heart that’s got to do with greediness. Maybe, maybe. 9 But those who crave the wealth of this world slip into spiritual snares. They become trapped by the troubles that come through their foolish and harmful desires, driven by greed and drowning in their own sinful pleasures. And they take others down with them into their corruption and eventual destruction. 10 Loving money is the first step towards all kinds of trouble. Some people run after it so much that they have given up their faith. Craving more money pushes them away from the faith into error, compounding misery in their lives! (1 Timothy 6:8-10 TPT).


I like the way that the Passion Translation puts it, don’t you? I’m going to quickly read this to you from The Message translation. Verse six, 6-8 A devout life does bring wealth… Why? Because when you fear God, wealth is going to follow. … but it’s the rich simplicity of being yourself before God. Since we entered the world penniless and will leave it penniless, if we have bread on the table and shoes on our feet, that’s enough. 9-10 But if it’s only money these leaders are after, they’ll self-destruct in no time. Lust for money brings trouble and nothing but trouble. Going down that path, some lose their footing in the faith completely and live to regret it bitterly ever after (1 Timothy 6:6-10 MSG).


Wow. Okay, going to spend a little bit of time here this morning. Just covering some of the basics here that we need to, about money. Who’s got? Sharon, have you got any notes on you? No notes. Who’s got some notes? Thank you, Empie, just a few notes. That’s good. I don’t want to give any of it away. I just need to just need a demonstration. That’s all, thank you. I will give it back to you, not giving your money away. A seed? Oh, he just gave it to me. So what, what is this? I mean, isn’t this just paper? Right? It’s paper. This is paper. If I, if I take a match to this and burn it, it will burn like paper with ink, it will probably have a colour, it will probably have a smell to it. But it will just burn. It will just burn. 

So, actually, this has no value other than how much is the paper. Now what’s going on here is that a government said, “We will print these pieces of paper, and we will put a value on them and we will back the value through the Reserve Bank, that when you want to exchange something for another thing, you can use this as a transaction.” If I’m working for this, I’m not working for gold, I’m not working for silver, if I’m working for this, then when I have this in my hand, it’s no longer just paper it’s a representation of my energy. Can I put it this way? It’s a representation of capability and capacity. That’s what it represents. So, if I say I have a million of these, that would say, that would tell you that if I’ve got a million 100 Rand notes, that I’m a fairly capable person with capacity. 

Why am I capable? Because this [Pastor John holding R100 notes in his hand] has given me capability. It doesn’t mean to say I’m capable, it just means this has given me capability. This has given me capability and capacity. So if I’ve got a, if I’ve got a, what did I say, a million of these, if I have a million of these, it means I’ve got a lot more capacity than someone who’s only got 1000 of these. [Pastor John referring to money in his hand] Yes? 

So, this is only a measure of what I can transact. It is also a measure of how much energy I’ve put into it if I receive it. I need energy, I need capability and I need capacity. If I’ve got those three things, energy, capability, and capacity, then I know what I can do with as much money as that has given me. Yes? Now if I’m working the system of the world to bring me this, [Pastor John referring to the money in his hand] then I’m dependent on the world system and my capability in that system, my capacity in that system to deliver to me the amount of transactions that I can do with this. It’s a measure of transactions that I can do. Are you all with me? Now, if I take this and I say, “I refuse to acknowledge that this represents my capability, and this represents my capacity, and therefore I refuse to limit my energy capacity and capability to this measure.” My next question is, what’s my measure? Because my capability and my capacity are going to be a reflection of my energy. It’s going to be measured somewhere. 

So the Bible says, “To he, that has ears to hear, let him hear.” The measure that is given to him is the measure that he will be able to live by. Right? The measure he gives it in his life, that’s what you’re going to have as a harvest. How much am I living by that capability, by that capacity and by that energy? Yeah, I’ve got a choice. I can start to put into action a capability that is not mine, a capacity that is not mine with an energy that has already been provided for me. What am I talking about? If I say Jesus walked on this earth with a capability that He had with the Father, with a capacity that the Father gave Him with an energy level that was measured in the time of men. Then when I live by, according to the example that He gives me, I’m no longer measuring my capacity and my capability by this system, [Pastor John referring to the money in his hand] but by His system. 


When I talk to you, in the next session, I’m going to bring to you the question of law and grace. I’m going to try my best to bring the session to a close now. But if I love this system, if I love this [Ps John holding up money], I love the measure that it gives me because it measures my capability and it measures my capacity. It measures how efficient I am with my energy. And if I’ve got more of this than anybody else, that can show everybody else how capable I am, how much capacity I’ve got, and how my energy has been efficiently used. 


So I want to demonstrate to the system how much of this I’ve got. Because when I do that, it elevates me. And when it elevates me, it’s saying, “Look how good I worked the system.” And then you can be in a position where you look at other people’s lives and you say, “I thank God, I’m not like these.” Yeah. And that’s the way God wants us to behave? No. But that’s the way the whole system works and so they will tell you that you got to pursue the system with everything you’ve got with all of the capability. 


And if you give yourself completely to your capability, you will have a capacity and then your energy will reap returns for you. And then I can walk around and say, “Look how good it is.” Or perhaps, “Look how good I am.” Isn’t that what the love of money is? It’s not the love of the number of notes you have. But it’s a representation of your capability, your capacity and your energy. And so if you say, “If the Bible says the love of money is the root of evil, then it’s because I love what the money does for me, that it reveals my capability, my capacity, and how I’ve used my energy.” 


What I want to do is I want to trade that system, exchange it, my exchange, my exchange is that I choose to exchange that system for another system. What I now do is I say I take the way Jesus used His energy on the earth and I use that as the model of how my energy should be spent. Because when I live with the energy that Jesus lived by, then I’m accessing His capability and His capacity. There’s a big difference now. 


Now I cannot take anything to myself as what I’ve self-achieved, but I give all glory to Him for what He’s achieved. Now we’re getting to the matter of the law. Because if I want to live according to the law, then I am a self-performing, self-measuring, self-evaluating person. So the minute I do that, I have to obey all of the laws, but it certainly gives me a proper measurement tool. But it’s all about how I get it done. If I say, “I’m not going to live by the law, I’m going to live by grace.” I’m now exchanging an energy system that was based on a performance for an energy system that’s based on His love.


The minute I say I’m not living on a performance system, but a love system, I now stand back and say I’m exchanging my energy performance levels for His energy performance levels, which He already accomplished everything I ever need to accomplish, He already did it. Now I have to receive everything He’s got for me, based on His love for me. Now, I’m no longer in a state in a position where this becomes my measurement of my effectiveness, while I’m on the earth, what happens is my measurement becomes how much I love Him, and how much I’m in Him. And I don’t want to measure that what I want to do is live in Him, and then the words that I speak by Him, become the fruitfulness of capacity and capability. 


Now, I am not taking glory and honour to myself anymore. What I am doing now is, I am beginning to demonstrate how marvellous it is to live in Him. Then, when all of this blessing comes to me, I give Him the glory. And then also, when the stuff is in my hands, I am just a steward of His energy, His capability, and His capacity in me. When I steward that, Him and I have a relationship that is around an exchange or transactional system.


But the system is so useless, that in South Africa we have this note, it’s blue, purple, whatever you want to call it. In South Africa it has a measure, in America, it is a different colour, and it has a different measure. If you go to China, the Yuan has a different measure with a different capacity or ability. If you go to different other countries, the Euro, the Pound, whatever, they have a measuring system that the government and the foundation of the government have a measurement by.


So for me to say I am measuring my wealth, my capability, my capacity, I’m measuring it by the colour of the money and how much of the colour of the money I have, is what? It’s very fluid because it changes from country to country. It changes from place to place. It changes from one economy to another economy. So for me to measure this as a measure of my success, it’s what?


So if you are Bill Gates, or you are Mark Zuckerberg, or you are Elon Musk or one of those guys, and you have all of this wealth on a stock exchange somewhere, people just decide, no, no, we don’t like this share anymore because of these economic indicators. And we are just going to offload the shares, or we’re going to not do this, or not do that. And you are getting investment companies that make decisions, governments that make decisions. And suddenly they are worth 100 billion, and now they are worth 60 billion. And so some of us might say, “Well, sheesh, I can do with some of that,” you know. I’ll lose 40 billion on their behalf if I can have the 60. You know, I mean, it’s a good thing, too. I’m just trying to tell you that overnight, people can lose 40 billion of these. [Pastor John referring to the money in his hand] And it means what? It means nothing.


Because, if you were Steve Jobs, who is arguably one of the most creative, one of the most effective CEOs that ever was on the earth in terms of what he has done to change the world’s way of looking at technology, and he was worth billions. Then he got liver cancer. And they did everything they could to try and do a liver transplant on him. And technology is not there to do it. So he died.


I got news for you. When he left the earth, and he walked into eternity, there was nothing that he did on this earth, that meant anything to his future. Zero. Not the billions that he had, and not even the achievements that he made. The only thing that is going to be asked of him when he walks over that threshold of life is, “What did you do with Jesus? Did you believe Him or didn’t you?” So then if he says, “Yes, I believed in Jesus”, and he goes to heaven, then he is going to stand before Jesus, and He is going to say, “What did you do with the gifts and the talents and the capacity I gave you on the earth?” And he is going to turn around and say, “Well, if You want to have a discussion about that, look at my reputation.” And He will say, “No, no, no. I called you with your creativity to make wealth for the body of Christ. What did you do with that for the body?” “The body? The body, the church? Ecclesia? I don’t know anything about that.” “That’s the point, Steve. That’s the point.” [Thank you, sir…giving Empie back his R100 notes] Hallelujah.


So if we are saying, we want to live in the system of money, then we need to be in a place where we understand and recognize that the love of money is our problem. How much money we have or we don’t have, it’s not our problem. It’s not our problem. If someone’s got lots of money, and someone is living on the breadline, it’s not your problem. So what is the challenge? What system are you living in? Are you living in a system where money is the driver of all things? Or are you living in a system where the love and the grace of God and the faith of God is the driver of all things? Which system are you living in? Hallelujah.


So we are all on a journey where we are moving our life and our knowledge base. We are moving from being raised in one system, and we are moving ourselves into another system. All of us are on this journey. And we are at different levels of this journey. If we can speed this journey up a little bit, we are all going to be better off. So that is why, when people say I’m involved in church life, and I’m involved in God, oftentimes – not so much with our church, but sometimes it is – but oftentimes, I will make a decision like now, we are going to have this weekend. I can’t have another weekend like this for another month or two, at least. Why? Because of natural capacity.


You’re not, number one, you’re not used to coming for weekends to have long meetings like this. Number two, I’ve got all these other things I have to do in my life. Just fit the church into my capacity, because I have taken all of my energy to create this whole world. Don’t mess with what I have created for this other journey that I’m still on. Because I don’t fully understand the value of this journey that I am on. I’ve created my world, leave it alone please, it’s my world. And when I am kind of giving some time to this world, I want to go back to that world, because that is the one I have created for myself. It looks like me, feels like me, it smells like me, it is me. You know, it’s like people want to say… if it walks like a duck, and it sounds like a duck, it is a duck. 


If you say my world is not a reflection of me, go and check your world. It really is. It’s what you want, it’s where you want to be, it’s how you want to be. And so, whenever we can be in this place where we say, “Hold on a minute, I’m reevaluating my capacity and my capability in this world so that I can move into the world that God has for me.” The quicker we can make that switch, the much better off we’re all going to be. Starting with you. Amen. Praise the Lord.


Now remember, I got eight minutes left in the session, then we’re going to take a short break and then I’m going to come back and get into a few other things with you. Are you all okay here this morning? Are you getting something out of this here? Praise the Lord. Praise the Lord.


1 Corinthians 2; this is the scripture that we’ve been using for some weeks now when I’m talking about intentional relationships. ¹And I, brethren, when I came to you, did not come with excellence of speech or of wisdom declaring to you the testimony of God.² For I determined not to know anything among you except Jesus Christ and Him crucified. (1 Corinthians 2:1-2 NKJV) 


What’s he saying? I came to you, not with kinds of all sorts of words that make me seem good, but I came to you with the excellence of the knowledge of Jesus Christ, that’s in you. That we will know each other, according to Christ, not know each other according to fancy words. I come to you determined to know you according to the system of God that you have chosen to live by, and not the system of men that want you to live by that. “³ I was with you in weakness, in fear, and in much trembling.⁴ And my speech and my preaching were not with persuasive words of human wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power, ⁵ that your faith should not be in the wisdom of men but in the power of God. (1 Corinthians 2:3-5 NKJV) 


Let me just want to make a point for you right now. There are many men who have many words that have the foundation of their words, in the principles of God. They are still men’s words, they are still men’s philosophies of words, and they reflect their capability and their capacity, not God’s.


We need to live according to the wisdom of God, not according to the wisdom of men. ⁶ However, we speak wisdom among those who are mature, yet not the wisdom of this age, nor of the rulers of this age, who are coming to nothing. ⁷ But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, (1 Corinthians 2:6-7 NKJV) So, I want to say to you that the apostle Paul was declaring that he had mysteries that were revealed to him that he needed to reveal to others. That means there are some people that God has called that He will give revelation to, that when He gives them revelation, their job is to share the revelation so that it’s no longer a mystery. But it’s a revelation, not a wisdom of this age.


⁷ But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God ordained before the ages for our glory, ⁸ which none of the rulers of this age knew; for had they known, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. ⁹ But as it is written: “Eye has not seen, nor ear heard, Nor have entered into the heart of man The things which God has prepared for those who love Him. (1 Corinthians 2:7-9 NKJV)


I’ve been preaching about this – for those that love Him, as opposed to those who love money. Those who love Him. God has given us things that we can press for beyond what our eyes can see, what our ears have heard, and anything that we can even think of, because we love Him, not because we love money. Because we love the way that He brings things to us, not the way our capability brings things to us. The two systems are obvious.


¹⁰ But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. ¹¹ For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so, no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. ¹² Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, we have received not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God. (1 Corinthians 2:10-12 NKJV)


Can you see it? He’s making a direct comparison here. And a direct comparison is the wisdom of this age, the things that the age can bring you in terms of the capability of this age to bring you things, versus the wisdom of God, the Spirit of God that makes all things available to us, by the Spirit of God, for those who love Him.


And so, then we thought, the love of God is just a wishy-washy thing. It’s just like a thing you do in church on Sundays. Let’s praise God a little bit, and show Him I love Him. No, the love of God is a powerful force that drives your whole life, it drives everything. It causes you to have an exchange from one system to another system, causes you to want to live in the kingdom of God, and all of the things that the kingdom of God has for you, rather than in the wisdom of this age.


I’ve heard people say this to me, and from time to time I’ve used this from the pulpit. I’ve heard people say to me, “Nah, I’m not a guy that asked for permission. I’m a guy that says, if I overstepped my permission boundaries, I’d rather ask for forgiveness than ask for permission.” 


So what does that mean? That means I want to live by my set of rules. And where I break the rules, I’ll ask for forgiveness, but I will live by my rules as much as I can live by my rules. So, I’m not going to ask for permission I would rather ask for forgiveness. What spirit do you think that is? That spirit is from the wisdom of this age that says, “Hey, you are your own person. And you have your own desires and your own dreams and your own things, go get it. And don’t let anybody stand in your way. And if they are in your way, run over them.” Yes? 


And so if you are in a proper world system, they might say, “But do it nicely” you know, don’t make them feel bad you know. Do it in such a way, and if you’re really good at it, you can do it in such a way that when you do it, they don’t even know you have done it, then you have been really effective in the way you have run over people. So go at it, don’t ask for permission from anybody. Give yourself permission to do whatever you want to do.


And so when you’ve found that you have overstepped the boundaries of governance – social, emotional, legislative, any other way – when you see that you have broken the rules of governance, then ask for forgiveness, don’t ask for permission. Because if you have to always ask for permission, then you’re going to be one of those grey men that don’t achieve anything, they don’t go anywhere, they have no life because they are always asking for permission.


I suppose that is how Jesus treated the Father, right? “I’m not going to ask You for any permission, I’m going to live the way I want to live, I will create what I want to create, I will do what I want to do, I will walk where I want to walk, I will say what I want to say, and then if I overstep the bounds, Father, just correct me and I’ll walk in it again.” Is that the example Jesus gave us? I’m trying to bring this into a contrast for you. One example is the way that Jesus lived, and the other example is the way the world wants you to live. The one is the spirit of disobedience, it is the spirit of the world that is in darkness. They don’t know how to live according to rules. It’s their own way, or it’s no way.


But the spirit of obedience says, “God, show me the way I should live in. Guide me, direct me, and let me not move until I know there is peace inside of me that You have permitted me to do this. You will authorize me, You give me, You show me the way that I should live, and when I have all of those things, then I will make my move.” It’s a completely different way of seeing things. Yeah. Hallelujah.


And so when it comes to Money with a Mission, I can honestly say that Pastor Sharon and I, it’s one of those things – and I’m going to finish our session with this – it’s one of those things, that people that are poor, have a greater capacity to walk in the ways of God than those that have wealth. And I’ll get into this at some point over the weekend, but people that are poor, have no other option, they are desperate. So what is it that they have faced with themselves? 


They have already faced in themselves, “I have no magic capability. And the capacity that I can connect with, I don’t have this capacity that other people were born with, or other people have been gifted with. So my capability and capacity are so low, that I have no other choice but to use my energy in a system that delivers me from this system.” So then they go and they say, “I’m going to go with God, and I’m going to speak God’s Word, and I’m going to flow with God because I recognize that I can’t change my stuff. I’m going to have God help me change my stuff.”


How do I know this? You’re looking at one of them. Pastor Sharon and I were poorer than a church mouse. We had no money, and we had very little capability, and obviously, our capacity was very small. But we had a revelation of the Word of God, and what words of God in your mouth could do. So we made a determination that we are going to embrace that system fully. And we are going to live by God’s way of doing things. Because what else have we got to turn to? We are going to do this system. 


And when we started to do this system, we would stand in front of our cupboards that had no groceries in it, and in front of our fridge that had nothing in it. And we would stand there and use the words of God and say, “Be full of groceries, be full of goods. Life, be full of the blessing of God.” And our words brought from the system of God into the natural, full cupboards, full fridges, and full everything. So we gave ourselves the option of living according to His system, not by money. Our transactions were more with the energy that God gave us in His capability and His capacity than it was in our own.


Do I work? Did I work? Yes. Did I exercise all of the capabilities and capacity that I had? To the fullest. But that wasn’t enough to deliver me. And today, I’m extremely glad that I had this revelation, because if I had maybe grown up and got a degree, maybe if I had all these things, maybe I would never have learned this from God. But because I had no other option, I went to God. And God showed me how good He was, showed Pastor Sharon how good He is, and we went into that system, and we gave ourselves fully to it. So it is too late for anybody to tell me that God’s system doesn’t work. I know it works. I’ve lived according to God’s ways of doing things.


So when we come back, we will talk about some of those things that are law-based and grace-based, when it comes to money. Let us take a 15-minute break, and I’ll see you back in the auditorium at around 10 past 11. Is that good? And then we’ve got about 50 minutes that we can finish off the session today. Maybe an hour. Are you good for this? Okay, go have a body break.